Unlimited: Ashley Kletke on Purpose, Strengths, and Flow

Welcome to the Brave Women at Work podcast. This is your host, Jen Pestikas. I’m so glad you’re here.

Hey everyone! How are you doing out there?

“When women get together as a group, it’s immensely powerful.” — Annie Lennox

This is the power of podcasting. I am humbled to build a virtual community of amazing and powerful women. My guest today, Ashley Kletke, is the sister of one of our powerhouse authors in the latest Brave Women at Work anthology. Thank you, Jennifer Lentner, for the introduction! See how we can get together as a group? It can be virtual or in-person, and women need to lift one another up.

So, if you inspired by that, I call on you this week to reach out to another woman in your life. A woman that needs a good word, a in-person or virtual hug, motivation, or support. You have no idea the ripple effect it will have.

Today on the show, Ashley and I dive into something so important and foundational – purpose.

During today’s show, Ashley and I chatted about:

1. The meaning behind unlimited to Ashley, especially since her company’s name is You Unlimited.
2. Why is purpose so important, and how do you we go about finding our own purpose?
3. How does Ashley leverage CliftonStrengths in her work with teams?
4. What is the intersection between purpose and CliftonStrengths?
5. What is flow state coaching?
6. When was the last time that Ashley was in a flow state?

Unlimited: Ashley Kletke on Purpose, Strengths, and Flow

 

Welcome to the Brave Women at Work podcast. This is your host, Jen Pestikas. I’m so glad you’re here.

Hey everyone! How are you doing out there?

“When women get together as a group, it’s immensely powerful.” — Annie Lennox

This is the power of podcasting. I am humbled to build a virtual community of amazing and powerful women. My guest today, Ashley Kletke, is the sister of one of our powerhouse authors in the latest Brave Women at Work anthology. Thank you, Jennifer Lentner, for the introduction! See how we can get together as a group? It can be virtual or in-person, and women need to lift one another up.

So, if you inspired by that, I call on you this week to reach out to another woman in your life. A woman that needs a good word, a in-person or virtual hug, motivation, or support. You have no idea the ripple effect it will have.

Today on the show, Ashley and I dive into something so important and foundational – purpose.

During today’s show, Ashley and I chatted about:

1. The meaning behind unlimited to Ashley, especially since her company’s name is You Unlimited.
2. Why is purpose so important, and how do you we go about finding our own purpose?
3. How does Ashley leverage CliftonStrengths in her work with teams?
4. What is the intersection between purpose and CliftonStrengths?
5. What is flow state coaching?
6. When was the last time that Ashley was in a flow state?

Important Links

• • • • • • • Hello@bravewomenatwork.com
            • Brave Women at Work on Apple Podcasts
            • Brave Women at Work on Spotify
            • Brave Women at Work website
            • Official site: www.you-unlimited.net
            • Ashley LinkedIn

About Ashley Kletke

Ashley Kletke is the founder of You Unlimited Coaching and Workshops. You Unlimited helps organizations uncover their purpose, elevate their strengths, and engineer their cultures.

As an engineer turned performance coach and facilitator, Ashley has a unique ability to bridge the analytical and the human — helping individuals, teams, and businesses move forward with clarity and purpose.

Ashley’s work is rooted in the belief that when people understand their unlimited purpose and leverage their individual strengths, that’s when they truly become unlimited. She uses CliftonStrengths as one of her core tools in her work with teams, helping them move beyond simply agreeing that collaboration matters to actually knowing how to do it. She also weaves wellbeing and flow state coaching into her practice, with a firm belief that wellbeing is fuel for performance — not a nice-to-have, but a necessity.

Based in Mattawan, Michigan, Ashley works with people and organizations ready to get clear on the purpose behind their goals and build the tools to be their best selves — at work and in life

Welcome to the Brave Women at Work podcast. This is your host, Jen Pestikas. I’m glad you’re here. Hey everyone, how are you doing out there? This time I want to start with a quote. I picked up this oldie and goodie from Annie Lennox. The quote is: “When women get together as a group, it’s immensely powerful.” And I have to say this is the power of podcasting. I am humbled, I think it’s been about four, I might be rounding the corner on this podcast of almost five years, but I’m humbled that I’ve been able to build a virtual community of amazing and powerful women. And I don’t say it enough, but I want to underscore that every woman has been a healing salve to me, a sage, a teacher, a friend, an expander. Every one of the women have come into my purview for maybe a day or a season, or maybe some of them will be there for a lifetime, but man, do I feel lifted up by these women.

My guest today, Ashley Kletke, is no exception. She in this conversation really lifted me up and I was excited to speak with her. And speaking about community, she is also the sister of one of our authors in the latest Brave Women at Work Women’s Anthology series. That book is Brave Women at Work: Lessons in Authenticity, and it is now on Amazon in ebook and coming out in hardcover in June of 2026. I want to share a big heartfelt thank you to Jennifer Lentner for introducing Ashley, her sister, to me, because it’s been wonderful. And I want to reflect back on Annie Lennox’s quote on the question of seeing how we can get together as a group. It can be virtual, in person, and again, we need, of all times, of all places and spaces, we need to lift one another up right now.

If you are inspired by the quote and the idea of women in community, I call on you this week, I challenge you whenever you’re listening to this, to reach out to another woman in your life. A woman that needs a good word, an in-person or a virtual hug, some motivation or support. You have no idea what listening, giving a hug, being there for another woman, what that is going to have in terms of a ripple effect. I know that in periods of when I’ve been downtrodden, when I have had burnout, when I have been in the dumps, and even when I’ve been on top of the mountain, having another woman by my side has made all the difference. Be the ripple effect this week.

Today on the show, Ashley and I dive into something also important and foundational: our purpose. During our chat, we discussed the meaning behind “unlimited,” the term unlimited to Ashley, especially since her company’s name is U Unlimited. Why is purpose important? It’s not a jargon term, purpose is really important. And how do we go about finding our own purpose? And no matter where you are, I didn’t really start finding my purpose until I was solidly in my 40s. You’ve heard things, Julia Child or Vera Wang, other famous women, it can be you, it can be me, we can find our purpose at any age or any stage. How does Ashley leverage CliftonStrengths in her work with teams? What is the intersection between purpose and CliftonStrengths? Now starting to weave together some of Ashley’s modalities of her work. She also has something called flow state coaching. We dive into what is a flow state, how does she leverage flow state coaching with her individuals and her teams and organizations. And then last but not least, I ask Ashley, “When was the last time you were in a flow state?” You don’t want to miss that part of our conversation.

Here is more about Ashley. Ashley Kletke is the founder of You Unlimited. You Unlimited helps organizations uncover their purpose, elevate their strengths, and engineer their cultures. As a former engineer turned performance coach and facilitator, Ashley has a unique ability to bridge the analytical and the human, helping individuals, teams, and businesses move forward with clarity and purpose. Ashley’s work is rooted in the belief that when people understand their unlimited purpose and leverage their individual strengths, that is when they can become truly unlimited. She uses CliftonStrengths as one of her core tools in her work with teams, helping them move beyond simply agreeing that collaboration matters to actually knowing how to do it. She also weaves wellbeing and flow state coaching into her practice, with a firm belief that wellbeing is fuel for performance, not a nice to have, but a necessity. Based in Michigan, Ashley works with people and organizations ready to get clear on the purpose behind their goals and build the tools to be their best selves at work and in life.

If the Brave Women at Work podcast has helped you personally or professionally, share it this week with a family member, a friend, or a colleague. It is no secret that I’m trying to get this podcast as far and wide as I possibly can, leave a rating and review, it matters, it can help get this in the hands of 95 countries, 96, 100 plus countries. I mean, who knows where we can go, I’m starting to sound like the Dr. Seuss book, but you mean. Thank you again if you’ve left a rating and review, or you’ve shared the show, whether the whole thing or individual shows, I thank you.

And then last but not least, I haven’t shared about this in quite a while, but did you know that I have an affirmation deck? A physical product that I launched in 2025. I still have some decks out there and I’ve seen them on some of my colleagues’ desks at my office, and it’s again humbling to see. They’re a beautiful quality, there are 54, I know we’re overachievers over here at Brave Women at Work, not 52, there are 54 affirmations right in the deck, and it answers the question of how can we be braver at work. It is not me that did all that, it is again the women in our community that have come forward. It is former or alumni of the Brave Women at Work anthology series, it’s former podcast guests, it’s members of the community, and they’re still available. If you have a special woman in your life that you want to give this to last minute for Mother’s Day, or an upcoming birthday, or to say thank you, I hear you, I see you, and I love you, go to bravewomenatwork.com and you’ll find them right on the site. Alright, let’s welcome Ashley to the show.

Hello Ashley, welcome to Brave Women at Work. How are you today?

Hi Jen. I’m doing really well. How are you?

I’m good. I’m glad it’s been a little bit here. I’ve been talking to so many people, I actually talked to someone this morning. I’m getting introduced to so many amazing guests, I have to tell you Ashley, that I forget who introduced me. Now, I know who your introducer was, the great Jennifer Lentner, your sister, who I have to give a shout out myself to. She is one of our authors in Brave Women at Work: Lessons in Authenticity coming out soon. It’s wonderful to connect with you and have you on the show today.

Thank you, and I am super excited about that book and seeing it live and ready to go and her contribution among many. I can’t wait to see it live.

I know, it’s going to be great to have it in everyone’s hands. Everybody, it’ll come out in June. But the ebook is coming out soon. Alright, Ashley, why don’t you start with a little bit about you and your background story and how you’ve gotten to where you are today?

Alright. I’ll try not to make it too long. How I got here today was basically by making my best guess and being open to the opportunities that presented themselves. I started out, I got a mechanical engineering degree because I had always been fascinated by how things work and how do you get them working better, faster, stronger. And I was good at science and math, I got that degree. Then, went into a full-time role as an engineer after all the college and internships. Did that for a while and then was presented with this opportunity to become a recruiter. A big shift off of what I thought was my career path. I really listened to why people were thinking about me for that and decided it was a great opportunity. That in that role of recruiter in human resources is where I got my first taste of strengthsfinder, now known as CliftonStrengths, and became a certified coach on CliftonStrengths. Immediately that was a tool, actually not immediately, I was a skeptic at first. It very soon became a tool that I really believe in and now provide a lot of value for others with.

Then, along that career path, the next thing that presented itself was a little bit more on what I thought might happen, I became a leader in operations. Immediately started using strengths and my passion for wellbeing as a way to engage the people on my teams. Then, flash forward, moved into human resources leadership and then went part-time into an individual contributor role. That was a really huge shift, one I will never regret, it was absolutely the right thing for me, for my family, and at the same time, it was an identity crisis. Because up to that point, and I think you and probably a lot of people can relate, I had been striving for the good grades to get into the college to get the degree. And then in your job, do well you can get the promotion and the accolades come from the hard work and the accomplishments.

As a mom, you can be really great at it and you’re not going to get a raise or a promotion. It was, I needed something that gave me something to strive for. I really did a lot of searching on my own purpose and crafted a purpose statement. Moving on from that, I was offered a wellbeing leadership role at the company that I was at, this was all at the same company by the way. Within that, I created a purpose workshop based on my own experience of how to define that. And with my team developed a holistic wellbeing program for our employees that was not physical, it was career wellbeing, social wellbeing, financial wellbeing, community, and physical, all built upon the foundation of knowing your own individual purpose. That’s based on the wellbeing book, by Clifton, one of the Gallup authors, adding in that purpose piece.

Within that role, we had to really shift a culture. Like many people and organizations, we had to, in order to get people to engage in our wellbeing programs, we had to do a mindset shift because so many people were, “I’ll work on my health and my wellbeing after this quarter, after this quota is hit, after this project is done, it was always out there somewhere when.” And we needed to shift that so that people would work on their wellbeing in order to meet those goals. I really reflected a lot on how we did that, how did we shift, because we really had excellent engagement in our wellbeing and it shifted the culture.

Then I moved into a more traditional HR leadership role. And within that, was offered the opportunity to lead the facilitation of a big culture shifting initiative for the whole organization. And that was pretty neat because it was taking everything that I had learned and experienced so far and giving credibility to my instincts and a lot more education on how to really do this well.

Then, after 23 years at this organization, there was a lot of restructuring happening and I was looking at my opportunities within the organization and realizing that all along since that very first role in human resources, I had always thought someday when I’m old and retired and bored, maybe I’ll start my own business and maybe I’ll do these things that are my favorite things, strengthsfinder coaching, wellbeing, things like that. And I realized that, why wait? Maybe now is the time to take that opportunity and after much debate and heartache, decided to do that, left that organization and started my own business. On the belief that we are unlimited in what we can accomplish when we know our purpose and we’re at our best. Now, that’s what I do with people, with teams, with businesses, I help define purpose and be at their best. Purpose is a pretty specific thing, the at your best piece can take a lot of different angles. Sometimes it’s with strengths and cliftonstrengths team blends, sometimes it’s with wellbeing, sometimes it’s helping a team shift their culture in some way. Sometimes if I really get a fun opportunity, I get to talk about flow, and sometimes it’s simply being a third-party facilitator for a group that needs to get from point A to point B.

And it’s amazing, there are so many people that, when you’re in school, people think, I’ve got a daughter that’s entering freshman year of high school, which makes me want to cry. I can’t believe that’s happening. And she’s already getting that pressure of, what are you doing for the rest of your life? And we’re going to be talking about flow state today a little and I don’t know, maybe the best way is to go into flow to find that purpose. And I’m glad that you do and you have found the work that you do today to help others because I think that it’s counter-cultural and it’s not the norm.

Yes, there’s more out there about it than there used to be, and yet still so much opportunity to do more with it.

Exactly. Let’s break down some of the words that you shared, some of the things. I’m going to start with the name of your business, You  Unlimited, which you explained, but the idea of being unlimited, what does that mean to you?

That means at our best, with barriers to our best self removed. I feel like so many of us, I know I do, have always had this sense that there’s more I can do, there’s more I can accomplish, there’s a bigger impact that I can have, it’s in me. And what’s in the way? I think we all struggle with that a little bit, or a lot. And being unlimited is removing those barriers and allowing all the natural, wonderful traits and characteristics of our true selves to go out and be in the world and have the impact that we were meant to have.

I love that. And I want to add on to this and not planned, but I want to ask this, you talk about best. And it’s so weird, I think that there is a natural flow and order to things and I was talking to someone about what is our best. I’ll start by saying, I think best is I know that I have done what I could do. I tell my girls, do your best and leave the rest. As long in your heart that you know you’ve done what you could, let it all be on the field and be done with it. But I deal with a lot of clients that will say, “I should have, I could have done, I did this”. When you have that, how do you get people to really have some boundaries or some bumpers on best so that they can actually have that well-being? Because best can be a very slippery slope for some people.

That’s a such a great point. And first of all, I would love it if our kids came up more throughout this conversation. I have a senior in high school about to graduate.

So you’re on the opposite side.

He leaves for the Marine Corps weeks from now.

Jen: Oh my, congratulations mom. I’m also worried. Let’s send prayers and all the blessings, yes.

Ashley: Of all people, I am not going to be the one that stands in the way of his purpose, which I really believe this is. As hard as that is as a mom, I am so proud of him and excited for him because this is his path. And then a freshman in high school as well. When I think about what you said, my parents gave me a little plaque and it hung in my bedroom wall forever and I’ll never forget it and it said, “At the end of the day, if you have done your best, wait the results in peace.” And I don’t know if I really knew what that meant then, but it stuck with me and now I feel like I do. And best self, honestly I struggle with the words around this sometimes because it’s not always about striving and it’s definitely not about perfection. It’s more about being true and understanding who you are. Our core identity, what are our natural strengths, talents, values, passions? Those are the ingredients of who we are at our core. They are already what make us great, and sometimes we don’t even know what those things are. When I talk about best self, it’s figuring that out, what are the things that are really truly unique about you that have already made you successful in whatever ways you’ve been successful, how can you embrace those, learn more about those things, because so many times we undervalue our own strengths. Because they come easy to us. We think, “Oh that’s easy, anybody can do that.” No they can’t. Not everybody has the same strengths, and because it’s easy for us is why it’s valuable, it’s why it’s a strength. And in order to be at our best, all we have to do is learn what those things are, accept them, and try to use them more.

It’s so interesting you say that, thank you, because I think this is something that my clients, myself, there are so many of us that struggle with striving rather than best because it is slippery there. But one thing that’s interesting about our strengths, which we’ll talk about, is we do take them for granted. I had no idea that interviewing people would be a strength, but if you look back in the seeds of the planting, I had a philosophy class, and I’ll never forget what the professor put on my philosophy paper, and he said, “Curiosity cannot be taught,” that’s what he wrote on the top of my paper. I am a natural, I’m curious about you, Ashley, I’m curious about my guests, I’m curious about people period, which I have a feeling you are as well. And that’s actually what makes that strength of having curiosity, that strength of having the gift of gab, allows me to do this, but I take it for granted sometimes and I think we do that where I’m like, “Oh well anyone, the imposter comes, anyone could do a podcast, anybody could interview people,” but that’s not necessarily true.

No. That’s a perfect example. And what a gift that instructor gave you of pointing that out. Because you could have gone your whole life without realizing that that was different than other people in a very good way.

Yeah, in a very, very good way. Let’s break down some of the words defining, which is the crux of our conversation. Yes, in the personal development world, there is work on purpose. But not a ton, as in some of the other, I’ve heard a lot in the last few years as I’ve been interviewing people, resilience, the book that’s coming out is on authenticity, those are some of the words. But I don’t hear a ton on purpose. Maybe I’m missing it, maybe it’s a burgeoning field or it keeps growing, but what would you say your personal definition of purpose is and why it’s so important?

There has been a lot of work, and the most compelling work around purpose I actually found when I was researching flow state. We’re going to get to that, but purpose, my definition of it is: your core identity in action. What is your core identity? That is what is true at your heart and soul: your strengths, your values, your passions. That’s all internal, it’s who you are. And then your purpose is simply, how does that show up in the world? What do you do with that, or want to do with that? That is your purpose. I’ll give you an example, my purpose statement that still gives me shivers because it’s so meaningful to me, is that I move us all forward by elevating strengths and sparking insights. And I do that with my own strength, truth, love, and energy. It is very meaningful for me, it is words to anybody else, but it incorporates my values, my strengths, my passions, and it is about how I show up. How does that play out? If you have a very strong purpose like that, or your own, of course, it becomes a filter. The big decisions in life, like, do I take a different opportunity at my company or do I start out on my own? Or any big decisions like that become a lot easier when you have this filter. If I’ve got two choices, which one allows me to do this more? It’s a huge filter.

Repeat that one more time. If someone wanted to create, because I’m all about action orientation, they’re like, okay, that was beautiful, Ashley, and it really was, your purpose statement, and I could see that that really lit you up. If someone wants to write their own purpose statement, what again is the formula?

The simplest version that I could give someone is to sit down with a notebook and look into three different elements of who you are. What are your strengths? Those are the things that you are naturally great at, like you being curious. There are lots of ways to find that. The second piece is, what are your values? You find these by thinking about, I believe we all live upon our values, but may or may not have really ever thought about what they are. But they’re the things that are non-negotiables for us as to how to behave, how to treat other people. They’re the, what would you stand for, what would you stand up for, what would be a big red flag as to somebody and how they treat you, what is obvious to you that of course this is how you treat other people. Those are your values. And then your passions are simply the things that fire you up, that get you excited, the things that when someone starts talking about it with you, you can’t stop. The hobbies, the interests, or even the causes, the things that fire you up. Strengths, values, passions. Once you have a clear idea of what all those three things are for you, that is who you are. And then your purpose statement is a separate thing, it’s how do you use that or want to use that. It can be both already true and aspirational.

Sometimes it can be a little intimidating, like that word best self, it feels like it has to be big, it has to be perfect. I want to back off from that. It can be a micro-purpose. It could simply be the purpose for my day. And I could look at my strengths, values, and passions and pick one and say, you know what, I am going to exercise this strength that I have of… I don’t know, one of mine is listening. And ask my kids a question and really listen to them. And that is one way of living out your micro-purpose. And then if you can get to a full purpose statement, that’s more your big purpose. And that doesn’t even have to be save the world, end childhood hunger. I mean, if that’s what you want it to be, that’s wonderful, but it can be simply, how do the things that are true about you show up in the world and impact the world in some way, big or small.

I love that. Everyone, I would go back on that one, take some notes, or we can also maybe package that in the audio or somehow get that to you guys so you can run that exercise because I think it’s really, really important for you to have your own purpose statement. I’ve done values, I’ve done vision, but I’ve never really done a purpose statement. That’ll be homework for me too, Ashley, so that I can have that lens.

Once you understand your purpose, I think I burned out, crashed into my purpose. I think the work I’m doing right now with women is a big part of my purpose. Once you’ve done that, how do you change, I’m guessing, personally or professionally, once it’s clear? One time I talked to a therapist and I had a realization and I’m like, “Can’t I unsee this?” She’s like, “No, once you’ve seen you can’t unsee.” I think once you’ve seen your purpose, you can’t unsee it. How does it change you personally or professionally?

Well, the first thing is that it is, like I said, a huge filter. When I’m struggling with a decision, if I catch myself struggling, I’ll be like, “Oh, Ashley, what would you tell a client?” I would tell a client to put this decision through the filter of your purpose. And every time I do that, it becomes clear to me what I need to do. The second thing is it is a huge motivator. In fact, there’s such interesting science behind purpose, and those who have a clear purpose, clear meaning, and those who don’t. With all of the inundation and the attack on our dopamine systems these days with all our electronics and immediate response that we have. If we have a clear purpose, that actually activates our dopamine system in a way that drives us toward long-term goals instead of short. Which is incredible to me because I am not immune to getting caught scrolling on my phone and then being like, “Oh, I wasted all that time.” Having a clear purpose gets us away from that, it motivates us toward whatever it is we’re heading toward. Again, a micro-purpose or a big purpose, or both. It’s a huge motivator even when times are tough and it feels like a grind. The science shows it and it’s true for me personally, if I read my purpose statement, I’m like, “Okay, alright, let’s go.”

And then the other benefit that is incredible to me is the health benefits. There are studies out there that are showing us that if we have a clear purpose, there are cardiovascular benefits. We’re 19% less likely to have a major heart event, like stroke or heart attack. Our immune system gets really a lot stronger because our sleep gets better. There are some stress-induced cytokines… please don’t ask me what that is.

I’m not going to.

…are reduced. And it improves our immune system. And the most compelling thing about this, and this science holds, I read it a long time ago and it keeps building. If we have a clear purpose, it reduces our chances of Alzheimer’s by 2.4 or 2.9%, even if we have the brain lesions that are associated with it.

Wow. I didn’t know that.

Yeah. Purpose is powerful.

Even if we have, like in our family, it runs in the family or we have brain lesions that would say, “Hey, you’re going to have Alzheimer’s, dementia, something in that,” it actually, what does it do again?

It reduces our chances of showing the symptoms by I think it’s 2.4%. It’s big.

That is big. I feel when I’m doing my purpose work I’m in a flow state, I don’t know if they’re synonymous. Why don’t you talk a little bit about flow state, and then we’re going to come back on how you incorporate purpose into your work. But let’s go to flow state because I think we’ve been teasing him a while, let’s talk about flow state.

Okay, and it’s such a fun topic to talk about. Flow is the state of ultimate human performance. When we’ve all had moments of this, whether it’s in a sport or a hobby or our work or maybe in music, where it becomes timeless, time flies by and we don’t realize it, “Oh my gosh, I’ve been doing this for an hour and a half, it felt like five minutes.” It’s effortless, it felt easy. And the outcome of that time is something that maybe it’s so great we didn’t even know it was possible. That’s what we’re talking about with flow. Now, a whole bunch of neuroscientists and psychologists have been researching what gets us into that flow state because it seems a little bit elusive, it happens and then it goes away. What they’ve discovered is that there is a four-stage process to flow.

The first is struggle. That’s the practice, the research, the grind, the worry, and you can apply this to a high-performing athlete or you can apply this to an engineer, whatever the situation, the steps are the same. Struggle. Then in order to get into flow, we must release. That means, maybe for us, we’re at our computer creating something and we go through the struggle, in order to get to that flow state, we need to stand up, take a breath, maybe look out the window at some beautiful nature, maybe go for a walk, release, not think about this thing anymore. Then we have the opportunity to get into flow, and that’s that magical state of performance and outcomes. Then, if we ever want to get into flow again, we have to do the fourth phase, which is recover. And that’s one that a lot of high-achieving, highly driven people skip. We have to recover or we’re going to get stuck in that struggle phase.

The looping, right?

People ask me how do you do this? I think it’s because I figured out my purpose. And then I go into these flow states, I don’t need, how do I describe it, it’s almost like, I am as guilty as everybody else, when I look at my phone usage it’s embarrassing, per day. Every Sunday it comes in, I’m like “Eww.” I get into a flow state so that I don’t need Netflix and chill, or I don’t need some of the other dopamine false hits, scrolling on Instagram, I mean again, I do it, of course, I’m human too, but I do it less because I have something else that’s really important that I want to be doing. Does that correlate to this?

It does, yes. Because there are those four phases of flow. There are also these researchers have discovered some very clear, reliable flow triggers. One of them is clear purpose. Having very clear measurable goals and clear purpose are triggers that are likely to get us into flow faster. There are several others. A few of them are complete focus, no distractions. If we can have group flow, and in that case we probably have some really good camaraderie, everyone in the group has skin in the game, everyone is taking part and has a role. There are several others, but that distraction and the dopamine hit is a really interesting one because it can get us into a stuck cycle of struggle, distraction, instead of struggle, release, flow. Release is in the flow cycle. Distraction is not the same thing. Release is we do something to take our mind off the struggle, and we allow it to be free. A lot of times our best ideas come to us in the shower or on a run. That’s because we’ve released, we aren’t distracted by anything, our brain is free to go. Distraction is, “Oh I’m in the struggle, I’m getting really frustrated, and I pick up my phone and I scroll Facebook for a few minutes,” or anything like that, and instead of allowing our mind to be free, that is drawing our mind to something else to take our attention away.

I get it now, yeah, and that makes a lot of sense. And I think I told you this in our first conversation, this should be taught in school, and I think you would agree, because we are not taught this, and we have so many distractions in our society that kids, bringing our kids back in, they don’t understand this at all. They have the struggle, then they distract, but they don’t allow themselves, “Hey, why don’t you get up, instead of being on TikTok, why don’t you go take a walk, because that’s going to free up the answer versus being distracted.” I hope that this is part of your future work.

Yeah, I would love that. And even with adults, I think all the technology that we have, our Apple Watches, I do not have an Apple Watch.

I don’t either.

Because I don’t want that distraction, I have an activity tracker, it’s one that doesn’t talk to me. Because if we have our phones and we’re getting the notifications all the time, it’s a distraction and we’re preventing ourselves from getting into flow, from having our ultimate performance, whether that’s at work or with friends at dinner. Those can even be flow states. Eliminate distractions, and if you love your Apple Watch, that’s great, I’m sure there’s a way that you can turn the notifications off, go see your data when you decide to see your data instead of when it tells you.

You might be the only other person I know right now that doesn’t have some sort of smart watch on their wrist. Yay us. We don’t have an old fashioned pedometer that you shake and the steps come. I told you I get into flow state probably pretty regularly now that you’ve defined it for us, I wanted to know when the last time you were in a flow state.

My most reliable flow activity is downhill skiing. That’s probably where I’ve felt flow the most. But the most recent is probably, I took a beginner’s art class. I am not an artist, never have been, I’m one of those people that says I can barely even draw a stick figure. Okay, we can all draw. All we need is a little instruction. If I’m thinking about this flow state, I remember I was in the room, it was a little bit out of my comfort zone, which is another flow trigger, a little bit out of our comfort zone, not too far. I was with a group of people I really enjoy, there was this nice camaraderie. And the goal was clear, I had this project and I knew what I wanted it to look like. And I just, it was time for the end of the two and a half hour class. I was like, “Oh my gosh, that really felt like 15 minutes.” And I had produced a drawing, I had no idea I could do it. It was cool.

That is really, really cool. I love that. I really love that example. For those of you that don’t think that you can do art, I actually saw this video, I need to share it here because it’s such a cool and fun, you want to talk about release exercise. If you envision, I’m going to try to explain this to you as much as I can here, let’s say you put pen to paper or a marker to paper, and you free, you free write, you free scribble different shapes, blob, modular, and you have it all in there. And then you get, let’s say you have crayons, or you get, you have your blob, and it looks like this big scribble blob. Then what you do is you take the individual colored pencils and you color in the shapes of the actual scribble blob. And when you start doing it, it actually makes this beautiful piece of artwork if you keep coloring in all the individualized shapes, and I did it with my daughter, my seven-year-old, and if I remember, I will post this on Instagram or accompanying this week when this podcast goes live. And it’s a very fun, low stress, and a proving exercise that anyone can be an artist. And I learned this in, I think Instagram or a video that someone posted, it’s definitely not mine, if anybody wants to do a little art and release in art, that is a very low stress way to do it.

Oh my gosh, I love that, I would love to see a snapshot of it.

Yeah, I will. I absolutely will if I can find it in my office, I will definitely share that with you. Okay, now we’re going to spin back around to purpose. We’ve talked a lot about it, now we’ve talked about flow state and how that all relates. But what are some ways, or how are some ways that you have incorporated purpose into the work you do with individuals and teams?

For many years I’ve done it purpose workshops for people and teams. And recently I’ve had two different collaborations that I’m excited about. One of them is with Jennifer Lentner who you mentioned at the very beginning. She and I, Jennifer is an expert in internal communications for organizations. And I’m an expert on culture. We are collaborating on a program called Two to One. It’s targeted at really any organization that’s going through big change, transition. And in many cases it’s maybe two companies coming together through a merger and acquisition or shifting from one owner to another. And ultimately, that’s usually groups that are either coming together for the first time or need to come together again, and where purpose fits into that is that’s the starting point. We have two different organizations with two maybe complimentary purposes, who are we when we are together? What are our strengths, values, and what do we stand for as one organization, and how does that show up in the world? That’s foundational to the work that we’re doing. And then that flows into the culture of the organization, how do we live this, what are the behaviors that are needed to demonstrate this? That’s one collaboration.

And then the other one is, a group that I’m working with, we have created a program to help people who are nearing retirement or recently retired find a very fulfilling and thriving life in that next phase. Kind of like my own story when I went part-time, retirement for many can be a pretty big identity crisis. Many of us are, that’s our work defines who we are. And where purpose comes into that, it’s one of three pillars of this program called Your Retirement Studio, it’s a place where people can come and explore and define and plan a beautiful, thriving retirement. Purpose is helping them understand, well, after all these years of striving toward a goal that was either created for me or set by others, what do I want, who am I? I help people define their new purpose, taking that core identity and redirecting it toward what they want to do with it in retirement. One of the collaborators is a brilliant and funny scientist, registered nurse, and health coach, she does the vitality piece, let’s make sure you feel good enough to enjoy retirement. And then Jen is a meditation teacher with a huge background in marketing and health system leadership. Her role is alignment, again, after having strived for goals for others or set by others, sometimes we don’t even know what we want. She’s going to help people attune to what it is they want. Those three pillars make a thriving retirement and we’ve got a whole program that people can self-select through in Your Retirement Studio to define that and live it.

That is cool, thank you for sharing those collaborations. And when we take this live, it sounds like those will be in more full swing, correct?

Yes.

Okay, that’s great. I want to ask you, since we talk about bravery here, what are one to two ways that you believe women can be braver at work today?

I think the first one is being clear on your purpose. Because it makes you less reliant on courage alone. If your purpose is clear, you don’t have to gut through it and be really brave. It’s more clear. It’s like, oh, this is non-negotiable, this is how it is. It lifts that burden of being brave. And then the other thing that I think really can we still need to be brave. And one way of doing that is embracing our strengths. There was a quote that I remember seeing when I was a teenager and it really stuck with me, it was anonymous, I can’t tell you who said it, but it was in a teeny bopper magazine and it was, “Try to be like yourself.” I love that, I think if we try to be like ourselves, that is very brave and that is what the world needs.

How can our listeners connect with you and your work online?

Probably the easiest way to find me is on LinkedIn, and you’ll find me under Ashley Brinn Kletke. My website for You Unlimited is you-unlimited.net. And then those two collaborations that I talked about, the first one is two-to-one, that’s two spelled out t-w-o, number 2, o-n-e dot net. And then the retirement studio is yourretirementstudio.com.

I love it. We’ll put all of that in the show notes. But Ashley, I love the work again that you’re doing and that you are a steward of our purpose and finding that in the world that can be unsteady. And I think this will make us more productive, well, happier, healthier, joyful, all of the above. Thank you so much for being on the show today.

Thank you, Jen. You’re an incredible example of strengths, values, passions in action. I’m glad you’re living your purpose and congratulations to you. Thank you for your time.

Well that’s a wrap on my discussion with Ashley today. I hope you found our conversation both valuable and inspiring. 

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Until next time, show up, be unlimited, and be brave.